Secundus.....

Show off your caddy
User avatar
TheGee
100BHP+
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 Stage 3+ TFSI
Location: Kent

Re: Secundus.....

Post by TheGee »

Another mini project and a continuation of an experiment from my previous van…sound treatment.

Int last van I used a prototype product from Silent Coat which was a 5mm deadener with a 1mm layer of MLV (Mass Loaded Vinyl). I used a metric shit ton of the stuff and in all honesty it was marginally better than mediocre but at 7x the cost. Other prototype and test treatments were used and the measurements were taken etc etc. However, at a tad over £1300 in product alone the results just didn’t match up, so, the deal was dumped.
Since then, I’ve been researching and testing products and treatments like mad and to the extent that my Umik-2 measurement microphone is pretty much permanently fixed to my roof shelf.

So, the challenge….2 for 10. Could I double the level of overall noise reduction for 10% of the cost.

I’ll be posting steps on here as well as an in-depth post in the how-to section but needless to say, yes I did
Instagram @geedubcaddy

New build thread >>HERE<<
User avatar
TheGee
100BHP+
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 Stage 3+ TFSI
Location: Kent

Re: Secundus.....

Post by TheGee »

Image

Got the seats sorted today with Audi R8GT Gen2’s all hooked up and toasty warm Image


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Instagram @geedubcaddy

New build thread >>HERE<<
Gmancan1
200BHP+
Posts: 255
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2023 1:50 am

Re: Secundus.....

Post by Gmancan1 »

Nice!!! I seen tan r8 seats (like them but with diamond stiching . Comfy?
Image
User avatar
TheGee
100BHP+
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 Stage 3+ TFSI
Location: Kent

Re: Secundus.....

Post by TheGee »

They’re quite firm and not as comfortable as the Golf R seats they replaced on long drive but I think it’s because I don’t have the seat positioning perfect. In the R8 they’re physically leaning backwards more because of the seating position but because they don’t recline (the R8 has the firewall immediately behind the seats) they sit very upright in the van. So, my only remaining option is set the rails backwards 6” so the seats believe they’re further forwards and away from the rear bulkhead and thus will recline. Probably lol I had an R8 for a few years & they were super comfy seats so I assumed being GT seats they’d be even more super comfy but not so tbh I wish I’d kept my R seats lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Instagram @geedubcaddy

New build thread >>HERE<<
User avatar
TheGee
100BHP+
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 Stage 3+ TFSI
Location: Kent

Re: Secundus.....

Post by TheGee »

Image

Image

Dash & consoles finished Image


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Instagram @geedubcaddy

New build thread >>HERE<<
User avatar
ToiletTFSI
Hyper Poster
Posts: 650
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:15 pm
Engine size/power: 1.4 16V Petrol (79bhp)

Re: Secundus.....

Post by ToiletTFSI »

like that, very nice.
User avatar
brooneye
Hyper Poster
Posts: 1490
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:51 pm
Engine size/power: 1.8 20V Turbo

Re: Secundus.....

Post by brooneye »

I really like that, looks totally different


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
User avatar
TheGee
100BHP+
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 Stage 3+ TFSI
Location: Kent

Secundus.....

Post by TheGee »

Thanks guys much appreciated Image

One thing I did forget about mentioning on here is the sound treatments I’ve ended up using to get the van quieter than a Mercedes S-Class (it’s been very accurately measured)
Some photos are missing because I can’t find them but I’ll add them in shortly.

So, the steps are many and everyone has their opinions on what works how where and why. I decided to test everything I could and measure the effects using an RTA and microphone.

Here’s what I did, the product used, and in the order of first to last.

Butyl rope, aka headlight sealer, aka butyl sealant tape.
Everything was stripped from the interior and all panel gaps, brace bars, etc, were very tightly stuffed with the rope. Warm it first with a heat gun so it’s softer and pushes into the seams. The most noticeable difference was the brace bars across the roof and the side panels inner to outer panels especially when driving in rain or a heavy headwind. The brace bar in the doors front doors made a small difference and I also used it on the joints between the outer rear wings and inner arches but it yielded no noticeable results.

The only purpose of this is to make the joints as rigid as possible and reduce any chance of resonance between panels.
Image
Image

Deadening. Aka sound deadening, aka constrained layer damping.

Firstly, 100% coverage is pointless. The only thing deadening mat does is add density to flat metal surfaces. It won’t make any significant difference in reducing anything that isn’t caused by panel resonance.

Use the biggest pieces of mat you possibly can as that’s how CLD is designed to work. Cardboard templates make it a lot easier and cut oversized to cover any lips and joints.
Image


I used single layer 2.5mm CLD sheets ONLY on the flat panels of the roof sections, rear side windows, side outer arches, inner wheel arches, outer door skins, front floor, under the seats, front inner arches, and bulkhead.
I also removed the arch liners and added a layer on the inner wing and the arch liners with an additional layer of 10mm closed cell foam.
Image

Lightly score the surface with 80 grit, thoroughly wipe down with isopropyl alcohol, warm the sheet and the surface and apply with light pressure using a smooth solid roller. Seal all edges with aluminium foil tape.


Closed Cell Foam. CCF.
CCF greatly reduces noise. It’s lightweight, easy to work with and it yields excellent results. I used adhesive backed foil coated ccf of different thickness depending upon the location of application. Roof and sides got 50mm, front floor and bulkhead got 10mm, and outer door skins got 25mm. Again, template makes life easy, use the largest pieces possible and aluminium tape all joints. Only use products suitable for vehicles or boats (hydroponic) due to water and moisture repellent properties especially in the doors.

Mass Loaded Vinyl. MLV.
MLV blocks noise. It’s heavy, it’s a bastard to work with, nothing sticks to it and frankly, if it wasn’t so effective I’d burn it all. I’ve used 1.5mm against the rear outer arches, front floor and bulkhead.

Soundproofing.
I tested over a dozen products and the best results were from Knauf Acoustic Roll. Fill every possible void with the stuff.
Image
The method here is not to pack it overly dense as the material needs a certain degree of space to work. The Knauf product is suitable for vehicles, it’s an earthwool so it’s not hazardous or harmful in any way, and it tears like soft bread which is great. Literally fill every space you find including all the way down the A-Pillars.
Image
Where you’re filling against MLV you can pack it a little tighter to keep the MLV stable.
Image
Also use behind trim panels with a light coat of spray glue on the panel
Image

Aluminium foil tape.
This is one of those little difference that makes a big difference things. Tape everything!
Image

My testing was done at 30mph, 60mph and 75mph on certain roads I travel often. So the M25 between Cobham Services and the A3, the M26 & A2, normal roads in central London and the countryside lanes of Surrey and Kent.
I won’t post all the measurements and results because it’s mind numbing but here’s the before and after from the Knauf Insulation Roll.
Image


On the M26, my van as a base model with no modifications on a dry day at 75mph produced 109.6db, now it’s 71.1db and it cost less than £250 Image
Instagram @geedubcaddy

New build thread >>HERE<<
snuffegull
100BHP+
Posts: 113
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2023 9:39 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 TDI (140bhp)
Location: Sweden

Re: Secundus.....

Post by snuffegull »

Im really digging the dash!
And nice work on the sound proofing! those are some great results
User avatar
Azz03
Hyper Poster
Posts: 770
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:28 am

Re: Secundus.....

Post by Azz03 »

Just be careful using fibreglass insulation in the van as it can hold moisture which can then lead to the panels rusting, from what I’ve seen on other build threads people are using recycled plastic Insulation as this doesn’t hold any moisture at all. I know it’s a big no no to use fibreglass insulation in the camper van building industry. Just thought I’d give you a heads up mate.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
User avatar
TheGee
100BHP+
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:27 pm
Engine size/power: 2.0 Stage 3+ TFSI
Location: Kent

Re: Secundus.....

Post by TheGee »

Hi @Azz03

I appreciate the intent of your comment and I don’t mean to sound rude but I specifically stated “The Knauf product is suitable for vehicles, it's an earthwool so it's not hazardous or harmful in any way”
I thought this would be enough to distinguish it from glasswool products but clearly not.

For reference, glasswool products are also harmless but they’re not suitable for a vehicle environment.
https://www.insulationshop.co/blog/most ... 0and%20USA.

Secondly, and again, as I mentioned earlier, I tried and tested almost every product available in the uk including the Diall recycled plastic rubbish from B&Q which is only designed for loft and cavity wall heat insulation meaning it’s an extremely poor acoustic sound reducing treatment. I used 5 rolls of Diall in my van giving a peak reduction of 2.1db. On the same road in the same conditions the Knauf gave an average reduction of 11.9db. The Diall cost was £110 whereas the Knauf was £74.
Instagram @geedubcaddy

New build thread >>HERE<<
Post Reply